Wishlist for version 2.6

Feature requests, and in-depth discussions of features and the way Mellel works

Moderators: Eyal Redler, redlers, Ori Redler

moineau
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Location: France

Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by moineau »

TomEck wrote:
moineau wrote:For French users :

Integration of non-breaking spaces.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-breaking_space

This is even more important than indexing.
Even if it seems--after my experience in another thread--that you don't like that I show you solutions for your problems it might be helpful for other French users to know: -> Insert -> Special characters -> Space -> No-break space (and more) or just Alt+Shift-Space
I've already found the shortcut in the wikipedia article, but thanks just the same. Fact is, your solutions are not really solutions for someone who wants to save time on simple things, not learn another shortcut, or use another third party software. I don't think i can get this message clear with you, from your post, but you have to understand that my purpose is not to denigrate Mellel, which is a great program for someone who likes to tweak things - tweaking important things - which excludes non-breaking spaces in French. Just to remind everybody that Mellel has already begun working on the French punctuation with the quotation marks, so it's not like I'm asking for the sky.
simifilm
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by simifilm »

moineau wrote:
TomEck wrote:
Even if it seems--after my experience in another thread--that you don't like that I show you solutions for your problems it might be helpful for other French users to know: -> Insert -> Special characters -> Space -> No-break space (and more) or just Alt+Shift-Space
I've already found the shortcut in the wikipedia article, but thanks just the same. Fact is, your solutions are not really solutions for someone who wants to save time on simple things, not learn another shortcut, or use another third party software. I don't think i can get this message clear with you, from your post, but you have to understand that my purpose is not to denigrate Mellel, which is a great program for someone who likes to tweak things - tweaking important things - which excludes non-breaking spaces in French. Just to remind everybody that Mellel has already begun working on the French punctuation with the quotation marks, so it's not like I'm asking for the sky.
Forgive me my ignorance, but what's the problem with Alt+Shift-Space? So it's a shortcut to learn, yeah, but how would you implement this without a new shortcut? You certainly don't want that the Space key always gives you a non-break space, so the obvious way is to use a variation of the Space key ...
rpcameron
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by rpcameron »

simifilm wrote:Forgive me my ignorance, but what's the problem with Alt+Shift-Space? So it's a shortcut to learn, yeah, but how would you implement this without a new shortcut? You certainly don't want that the Space key always gives you a non-break space, so the obvious way is to use a variation of the Space key ...
The request is not to use Space to insert a NBSp, but rather to have a NBSp inserted immediately before certain punctuation marks (! ? ; :). The problem with this is that it is a language dependent–type of style feature for French. Mellel doesn't currently mark sections of text as being in one language over another, so how to have the program differentiate between French and other languages is the new question.
— Robert Cameron
moineau
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Location: France

Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by moineau »

rpcameron wrote:
simifilm wrote:Forgive me my ignorance, but what's the problem with Alt+Shift-Space? So it's a shortcut to learn, yeah, but how would you implement this without a new shortcut? You certainly don't want that the Space key always gives you a non-break space, so the obvious way is to use a variation of the Space key ...
The request is not to use Space to insert a NBSp, but rather to have a NBSp inserted immediately before certain punctuation marks (! ? ; :). The problem with this is that it is a language dependent–type of style feature for French. Mellel doesn't currently mark sections of text as being in one language over another, so how to have the program differentiate between French and other languages is the new question.
Thanks rpcameron, you got my point. All I'd like to do is : in Mellel's Preferences / typography (since you already have "activate typographer's quotes" and "type: French"), to have the possibility to activate automatic non-breaking spaces before punctuation marks, just like in Word. It appears that's a difficult thing to understand for someone who doesn't use French typography.
frank
Got the styles thing figured out
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by frank »

I have only one required feature:

4. Undo after saving; hopefully unlimited undos. This is a basic feature for me (I know there is Time Machine, but sometimes that may not be enough to save a document after you've made changes you realize you don’t want).

Others:

Second: 6. Mixing landscape/portrait -- Nice to have.
Third: 16. Line/paragraph lines. Nice to have too.
Fourth: 19: Better MSWord compatibility.
DylanMuir
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by DylanMuir »

My list:

Top priority: 1 (indexing), 15 (image handling), ?? (force page breaks as a part of a style)
Second: 14 (improved tables), 11 (improved styles), 12+13 (opentype / fonts)
Third: 40 (versioning)

DRM
jb
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by jb »

I don't mean to say that the long list isn't already long enough, but I find it odd that no one has mentioned assignable keyboard shortcuts (perhaps I missed this?).

iKey does the job, of course, but its implementation is clunky. And since Mellel's styles are sui generis, the need to assign a (more friendly) keystroke combination to do the work of Function keys is unlikely to be needed outside Mellel. (My keyboard has very small function keys -- I can never find them with my fingers.)

Is it true that no one else yearns for assignable keyboard shortcuts?
Guntis
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by Guntis »

1) I've longed for PageMaker/InDesign-style styles for years. Still the same problem - once I change the default document style in my document, I cannot paste it in outher document without style editing problems later... Oh my, such problems in the 21st century... The whole styleset should go with the document and I should be able to edit and update style at any time.

2) Normal Toolbar with customizable buttons, as in all iWork apps.

3) KEYBOARD SHORTCUTS FOR TEXT ALIGNMENT!!!

4) Text flow around the tables and images.

5) Line spacing in points while rulers in cm mode.

6) All value entry boxes should have widgets to increase/decrease their value. Or sliders.

7) Legal numbering - 1.1, 1.1.1, 1.1.2, 1.2, 1.2.1, etc. When I work on legal documents (bylaws etc.), this is a must-have.

8) Ability to specify language for the individual words. We live in multi-language world and environment. But in Mellel I cannot use 1 or 2 English words in the Latvian text and have proper hyphenation and spellchecking. Maybe that's for the 22nd century?...
jannuss
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by jannuss »

Guntis wrote: 5) Line spacing in points while rulers in cm mode.
You can change line spacing to points in the Allignment & Spacing palette and/or in the Paragraph style set.

I don't think the choice of lines or points should have any connection with the choice of inches or cm

Janet
Hans-Reinhard Koch
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by Hans-Reinhard Koch »

Guntis wrote:7) Legal numbering - 1.1, 1.1.1, 1.1.2, 1.2, 1.2.1, etc. When I work on legal documents (bylaws etc.), this is a must-have.
This is also a RTFM problem. It's already there. You might want to check the auto titles in the guide
Regards
Hans-Reinhard
Hans-Reinhard Koch, Bonn, Germany
Hans-Reinhard Koch
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by Hans-Reinhard Koch »

Hi Ori, and all of the Redlers people,
I have one more wish: In the statistics Palette, it would be nice to also indicate the number of cross references.
Hans-Reinhard
Hans-Reinhard Koch, Bonn, Germany
rpcameron
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by rpcameron »

jannuss wrote:
Guntis wrote: 5) Line spacing in points while rulers in cm mode.
You can change line spacing to points in the Allignment & Spacing palette and/or in the Paragraph style set.

I don't think the choice of lines or points should have any connection with the choice of inches or cm
Also, any place that requires a measurement, the information can be input in points. If your box says "1cm", and you want 12 points, just type "12pts" in the text field. When the field loses focus (or you press "Enter") the value will change from "12pts" to the equivalent in centimeters.

In response to some of your other points:
  • There are keyboard shortcuts for text alignment, but they are found under the Paragraph Style menu. This is because text alignment is a property of a paragraph style, and managed through there.
  • There has already been a rather involved discussion of a language–based meta–level somewhere between the character style and paragraph style realm. (Or similarly, to have a language setting for hyphenation, spelling and other typographic features such as OpenType contextuals to be made a part of the character or paragraph style settings.) For the relevant discussion, see: Feature Request: True multi-lingual spell check.
  • I agree with your request for a true Aqua document window, and to have Mellel make sure of the NSToolbar and not use its own custom toolbar. However, interface tweaks should take a backseat to some more pressing inclusions.
  • I fail to see why every input field that includes a value should have a slider or spinner—one of those buttons next to a text field with arrows at the top and bottom increment or decrement numbers—to facilitate its change. Wouldn't typing a value be much faster than repeatedly clicking on a spinner control? Also, having a spinner or slider control just takes up valuable room on the palette or in a dialog. I personally don't feel this would be a good interface decision.
  • Text flow around images and greater flexibility with tables and wrapping is a much–requested feature. However, it is also one of the most difficult features to implement at this time because it would most likely involve a lot of work with their layout and text engine. Ori has indicated that this is on their to-do list, and will be coming in the future. Also, I believe that the inclusion of marginalia and unbalanced columns would be part of the upgrade because of the similarity in implementation.
  • And finally, as far as your request to have styles follow the document, I believe you need to be a bit more specific. Perhaps you could start a new thread indicating exactly what the problem is—with the steps to accurately reproduce it—so that the developers or other users can help you discover if this is a bug in the program or let you know what you are doing incorrectly.
I hope that you'll find this constructive and you become part of the Mellel community.
— Robert Cameron
Sayyaar
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by Sayyaar »

My vote on the most important next steps is as follows:

Most urgent:

Better Word integration (this is important for academic publishing, besides simply making life easier in general)

Second choice:

Marginalia and more control over footnotes and endnotes, together with more options for multi-column layout. For example, it would great to have the ability to format each column separately, almost like having two pages on one page, in order to be able to do parallel text and translation and get each piece of text to line up exactly where it needs to be with a minimum of fuss.
(This request is related to the problem of Word integration, because the footnotes are the biggest problem for successful export)

Third choice:

split window feature, for comparison and editing

My preferences are based on my profession as a Syriacist and an Arabist. It is very important to be able to have the ability to do marginal notes and critical apparatus for textual work.

Thanks to Ori and Eyal for all their hard work on 2.5. Mellel is an outstanding program, and I can hardly see myself ever using anything else. I look forward to writing my dissertation with it.
SYR
donb
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by donb »

The biggest problem in all this is that Microsoft has not made its code available to other programmers. Without this informtion, it is difficult or impossible to transfer many of Word's formatting details automatically to any non-Microsoft program. I have yet to find any Macintosh program which can do this. Even Abi Word, Open Office, and Neo Office are unable fulfil all your wishes.

Donald Broadribb
Sayyaar
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Re: Wishlist for version 2.6

Post by Sayyaar »

Just to clarify:

I take your point and am aware that MS Word integration is a difficult task. Perfectly seamless integration may never be possible, as long as the code is not available to developers as you say. I am only posting it as a desideratum. There would also be problems, of course, in situations where a future version of Mellel might support more advanced footnote features than Word, for example (as it is, a case can be made that Mellel already does this with things like multiple footnote streams).

In retrospect, I suppose that I cannot really complain about the level of Word compatibility and integration. It has been adequate for academic use, and it doesn't stop me from recommending Mellel to colleagues. In the end, better integration is just a wish, but one that I think is very important because Mellel is intended primarily for those whose profession involves publishing and collaboration (for example, a dissertation adviser returning a draft with comments)

My priorities might change, too, when I start working on the dissertation in earnest. I could see indexing becoming a top priority at that point.

Cheers,

Sayyaar
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