Image positioning

[rpcameron]

I think perhpas you may have different what constitutes "advanced fancy functions" than many others. Mellel is a “Word Processor” first and foremost, and as such it is created to process words, not page layout.

Image handling is nice, but for a program that is geared towards words, it is not mandatory.

There have often been assertions on the fora and mailing list that users expect Mellel to be a page layout program (like FrameMaker), but this is simply not the case. For those of us that primarly work in text, Mellel is a superb program, and the best out there.

In the time between when you started writing your response and when you posted it I changed the phrase "layout function" to "word processor function." You have to understand that in the year 2006, simple layout IS part of a word processor's basic functions. I'm not talking about magazine preparation layout, I'm talking about simple layout that is expected from most academic and professional writing in today's world.

A lot of writing I do is scientific, so I often have figures I reference in the document. If all of my images are in line then my paper would quadruple in page length. Scientific papers of today rely heavily on images, whereas in scientific paper of yesterday many images were described. Even in non-scientific writing, Like it or not, images and basic layout are an integral part of what is expected from most text documents today.

Yes, I noticed that your post changed during the time I started my response. However, I still stand by comment that full wrapping around a floating image (whether free-floating or anchored to one margin or the other) is a page layout function, and not a basic word processing function. While full wrapping would be nice, I don't consider it a prerequisite of a word processor.

In today's market image support is necessary, and Mellel provides this. It may not be as extensive as you require, but it is still present. (Mellel even offers baseline adjustment for inline images, which many word processors do not support.) As far as publishing papers, most journals perform some level of post-production and formatting on submissions; full wrapping around floated images is not a requirement I've ever seen for any journal, but please feel free to let me know if there is a journal that requires submissions in this manner.

[Harvey]

I’ve looked at Mellel, NeoOffice (derived from openoffice), Nisus, Word for Windows, and Pages. Pages and Word (for windows) have text wrap around images. NeoOffice appears to have it, but I couldn’t get it to work in few minutes I played with it. Neither Nisus, nor Mellel currently support this feature (although it’s seems to be on the Redler’s radar). You can try those programs, personally I prefer to stick with Mellel.
Regards
from Ottawa
Harvey

[Timotheus]

@rpcameron: Mellel is indeed a wordprocessor, but - if I understood some of Ori's messages well - a wordprocessor with the ambition of covering at least part of the field once covered by Framemaker. And even now, Mellel has features like for instance TOC and Mentions, which are not exactly typical features of a wordprocessor. Moreover, Mellel pays great attention to styles and to typographical output quality - and these too are not exactly characteristics of a common word processor.

But apart from that: images, tables etc. have become so common even in modest papers and reports, that any wordprocessor which is not of the TexShop / Wrangler / Smultron type should be able to handle them decently.

And another thing: I don't think it's in Mellel's interest to leave uncovered relevant features which are already covered by Pages. Don't underestimate Pages. Within a few months we'll undoubtedly have Pages 3, and should this version have for instance good outlining, then Pages becomes an interesting option even for academic writers.

[rpcameron]

@rpcameron: Mellel is indeed a wordprocessor, but - if I understood some of Ori's messages well - a wordprocessor with the ambition of covering at least part of the field once covered by Framemaker. And even now, Mellel has features like for instance TOC and Mentions, which are not exactly typical features of a wordprocessor. Moreover, Mellel pays great attention to styles and to typographical output quality - and these too are not exactly characteristics of a common word processor.

But apart from that: images, tables etc. have become so common even in modest papers and reports, that any wordprocessor which is not of the TexShop / Wrangler / Smultron type should be able to handle them decently.

And another thing: I don't think it's in Mellel's interest to leave uncovered relevant features which are already covered by Pages. Don't underestimate Pages. Within a few months we'll undoubtedly have Pages 3, and should this version have for instance good outlining, then Pages becomes an interesting option even for academic writers.

I'm well aware of the functions of Mellel—I've been using it as my primary word processor for several years. However, TOC, note streams and typographic details each pertain to the processing of words and not images. Mellel is still first and foremost the best program for working with words, and these textual features only reinforce that.

I also work with Pages; I used Pages extensively when I was producing the corporate newsletter for my company because of its page layout features. However, whenever I had a letter or other document to write I always turned to Mellel because of its superior text handling abilites. (I've also fortified my font portfolio with numerous OpenType fonts so I can get gorgeous type when I use Mellel, including Latin, Greek, Cyrillic and Japanese typography.)

I feel that Pages and Mellel cover two different demographics. As I stated previously I use Pages for layout and Mellel for text and word processing. Mellel's implementation of tables is quite adequate for inclusion in text intensive documents. Also, its image handling is adequate for text intensive documents. Perhaps I am in the minority here, but I feel that cross-referencing and full gloss support is far more important than text wrapping around images.

[kga1978]

I completely agree with BreakNeckRidge - in todays world a word-processor will have to be able to handle images correctly and this includes being able to wrap text around. The makers of Mellel tries to sell this as a "Word-Processor" for academics - and most, if not all academics, will require this feature.

I myself write articles in the natural sciences, and without this feature, Mellel simply isn't an option. I too bought the program without testing this "very obvious" feature, and I am very surprised to see it missing. Please include this in future releases.....

[Phil82]

I might be completely missing the point, but if you want text to "flow" around an image, you could do the following:

1) Create a table with 2 columns and 1 row.
2) Insert the picture into one column
3) Type your text in the other column
4) Remove the borders of the table

The only tricky thin is determining how much text to put into the table, but it is doable with a little effort.

While this feature is a nice thing to have, I don't see it as a show stopper as I rarely need to have a picture with text flowing down the side of it. When I do, the method I've outlined here works fine.

[kga1978]

We are familiar with this "work-around", but again this is not really an option. If you change - say - just one sentence before the "table", then the whole layout is screwed up.

Again, it may not be a problem for some, but for us academics - especially in the natural sciences - this really has to be included in a future release.

Mellel is indeed a great program, but they are trying hard to sell the program to academics writers, and so really should include this as soon as possible. I would LOVE to use Mellel at all times, but for now it is only useful for very simple writing tasks - not proper article writing.