Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

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guzferreira
Got the styles thing figured out
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Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by guzferreira » Fri Feb 28, 2020 3:33 pm

Hi,
I'm finishing my dissertation and there are two things that are driving me crazy.

First and more importantly, the bibliography generated is always placed in a new page, so I can not place a title over it. I'm using Bookends, but I do not believe the problem is with it because, when I create a new document and paste part of my text in it, the bibliography is generated correctly. Are there any settings I've enabled without knowing within my document - i. e. paragraph or character style, that I can switch back off?

The second thing I've been able to manage, but I would also like to know if there's a more straight forward way of doing it

I need two styles for Chapters (not headings and sub-heading), one style should not be numbered, for Introduction, Conclusions and References. The other one should be, like, 1 Blablabla, 2 Blablabla...

The problem is that there's only one Primary Section Auto-title. Is there a way to conditionally style it? Something like "For some chapters auto-title show numbers, for some do not"?

The way I've worked around this is by creating a tag flow for these chapters, or use a 5th level sub-heading (that I don't use), the problem is these auto titles get subordinated to the chapters or sub-headings immediately over them, so when I move my last sub-section around, for example, Conclusions and References come along, which I don't want.

I'm going crazy with these. Can anybody help me?

Screencap of the bibliography issue: https://imgur.com/a/SLnlG6o

Icelander
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Re: Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by Icelander » Sat Feb 29, 2020 10:13 am

The way I've worked around this is by creating a tag flow for these chapters […]
I'm going crazy with these. Can anybody help me?
Use Auto-Title Heading 1 for Introduction, Conclusions and References. Make sure the setting for Format, TOC format and Outline format has only 'Title' (no number.)

For the rest, use Auto-Title Heading 2, Auto-Title Heading 3, etc. with numbers and make sure that for these Auto-Titles you check "Reset numbering with higher level flow."
'Reset numbering' is the decisive thing and it should do the trick. You'll need to tweak Format, TOC format and Outline format to get the results you want.

Regarding the bibliography, your screenshot is not helpful because all invisible characters are INVISIBLE. When you send screenshots, please make sure that you first click on the 'Show' button in your toolbar and then enable "All Invisible Characters."
If you don't have a 'Show' button in your toolbar, then go to View > Customize Toolbar… and drag it into the toolbar.

guzferreira
Got the styles thing figured out
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2019 8:09 pm

Re: Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by guzferreira » Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:29 pm

Thank you for your reply.

Your solution for the auto titles is also a workaround. Now the whole thing is subordinate to the introduction, which is very weird in my view. It's better than my tag flow solution, for sure! As I see it, it is still a flaw in the software. We should be able to have two different formats for the top level heading.

In the case of the bibliography, I didn't even think of looking into invisible characters, so that in itself was already helpful. But, the only break I see there is a section break, which is included when the bibliography is generated correctly in a new document. Is it possible I have some setting for the new section that does that? I tried looking for it, but didn't find anything.

Here's the screenshot with the invisible characters enabled: https://imgur.com/a/73pGSSu
There's also the paragraph and the section styles that are applied to the bibliography (my interface is in Portuguese :wink: )

Icelander
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Re: Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by Icelander » Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:48 pm

guzferreira wrote:
Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:29 pm
Now the whole thing is subordinate to the introduction
Not by me. I'll upload a test document for you later today so you can take a close look at it.

guzferreira
Got the styles thing figured out
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2019 8:09 pm

Re: Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by guzferreira » Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:21 pm

Icelander wrote:
Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:48 pm
Not by me. I'll upload a test document for you later today so you can take a close look at it.
I tried it here. No way I can make the chapters below introduction be independent from it. I'd appreciate your test file. :D

guzferreira
Got the styles thing figured out
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2019 8:09 pm

Re: Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by guzferreira » Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:28 pm

Judging from this topic, there's no way to do it:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2039

So, yeah, I'll settle with the workarounds.

The Bibliography though, I'll need to copy/paste everything into a new document. :(

Icelander
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Re: Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by Icelander » Sun Mar 01, 2020 5:01 pm

Now the whole thing is subordinate to the introduction, which is very weird in my view.
I thought I had found the solution, but you are right, something is rotten here.

By me the chapters and sub-chapters are subordinate to the Introduction in the Outline, but the Conclusion and the References are not subordinate. The text-body looks normal, the Table of Contents is created correctly, the chapters are numbered, and the Introduction, Conclusion and the References have no numbers, like you wanted.
So, it's actually only the Outline which slightly deviates.

I also read the thread you mentioned and I was startled to see that the first post is from 2009, 11 years ago!

I suppose the developers have no intention to fix this. After all, they could argue that the Introduction is fixed as the first part of the document; there is and should be no way to drag a subordinate chapter in the Outline and place it (inadvertently) in front of the Introduction. Similarly, there is no way to drag the Introduction around, it always remains at the first place where it belongs. That's what the developers might say.

Or they simply don't know about the problem. They don't read the posts here, except when they post announcements themselves. Eyal has repeatedly said, bug reports and feature requests should be sent directly to him (not to the forum.)

Here is the test file:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/ssn3gu6se ... l.zip/file

Icelander
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Re: Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by Icelander » Sun Mar 01, 2020 5:13 pm

-
Last edited by Icelander on Sun Mar 01, 2020 6:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Icelander
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Posts: 260
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2014 10:59 pm

Re: Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by Icelander » Sun Mar 01, 2020 5:35 pm

The difference between my Esilo do parágrafo Bibliografia and your Esilo is that Margens Origem by me is 21 pt.

"Também na parte superior da pág/col" is NOT enabled by me.

Under "Manter opções" 'Manter linhas juntas is NOT enabled by me.

I don't know whether this is of any relevance here, but you could try to disable "Também na parte superior da pág/col" and see if that makes any difference.

Icelander
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Re: Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by Icelander » Sun Mar 01, 2020 6:16 pm

I see you have got *two* breaks: a section break (which is created after the last character in the document when you scan it. That is normal) and a line break which I don't get when I scan my test document. Why does your document end with a line break (instead of Return)?

guzferreira
Got the styles thing figured out
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2019 8:09 pm

Re: Bibliography insists in being placed in a new page

Post by guzferreira » Sun Mar 01, 2020 6:58 pm

Icelander wrote:
Sun Mar 01, 2020 5:01 pm
I also read the thread you mentioned and I was startled to see that the first post is from 2009, 11 years ago!
Exactely. I was shocked! I think you're right, the developers do not think this is something that should be addressed or they would've addressed by now.
Anyway, I just went with the Introduction as a top level, thing.

With the bibliography, I have no ideia what happened, but I spent last night copying and pasting everything into a new document and now it works. With the SAME styles, mind you, so I really don't have the faintest idea of what was wrong.

(The line break was set up after the auto title, but removing it didn't really change anything)

I'm already late to submit my diss, so... Water under the bridge! hahahaha

Your answers were really helpful, thank you again.

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